Living In The Philippines Forum

Getting Prepared For The Philippines => Hobbies and Interests => Topic started by: Terpe on September 28, 2010, 04:09:57 AM

Title: Rice Field
Post by: Terpe on September 28, 2010, 04:09:57 AM
My wife is now thinking it might be nice to buy a rice field. She has in mind a small 1 hectare plot. (that\'s why I posted in hobbies & interests!)
I did some research and came to the conclusion that financially (in a good year) she might break even or slightly better.
She is convinced it\'s a sound investment and will provide both an interest and a small income.
I told here it\'s maybe better to provide loans to rice farmers (joke joke)

Anyway, does anyone here have any experience of this ??? Good or bad!!
Peter
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: dylanaz on September 28, 2010, 06:48:04 AM
100% guranteed.... you will NEVER GO HUNGRY AGAIN !!!   ;D

Other than that I think you may be on track in terms of thinking about financial success with a 1 plot rice farm.

On the other hand local organizers of multi-dozen rice co-ops have made buku bucks !
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: MikeBal on September 28, 2010, 09:43:24 PM
We bought a rice field for my brother-in-law down in Sorsogon and a coconut farm for one sister-in-law and family in Quezon province. The rice field has kept him fed with a little left over. On years when they haven\'t been devastated by typhoons, the sister-in-law has done pretty well with the copra.
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on September 29, 2010, 02:02:18 AM
We bought a rice field for my brother-in-law down in Sorsogon and a coconut farm for one sister-in-law and family in Quezon province. The rice field has kept him fed with a little left over. On years when they haven\'t been devastated by typhoons, the sister-in-law has done pretty well with the copra.

Did pretty much the same thing for a brother in law in Butuan, but I decided to keep property in Gloria\'s name, with proviso that if brother in law achieved target harvest for 4 harvests we\'d turn it over to him.......he\'d claimed 120 kavans per harvest from 1.25 hectares

So far we\'ve only seen 80, 65, 80 & 85 cavan yields

We\'ve come to the conclusion that altho a loving family man .....he\'s NO business man.....pays too much for services and labour

Altho it does give him 20+ cavans for his direct family

20 cavans pays for next harvest

20-30 cavans go to other 5 siblings families**
**should go to us as owners but I prefer that siblings familes share the harvest


Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: dylanaz on September 29, 2010, 02:45:09 AM
So far we\'ve only seen 80, 65, 80 & 85 cavan yields

The rice field has kept him fed with a little left over. On years when they haven\'t been devastated by typhoons. . .

Locally... if a business keeps food on the table - its GOOD BUSINESS  :P


But for us westerners - that is usually not enough... to justify a business investment.
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: RUFUS on September 29, 2010, 03:31:27 AM
I told here it\'s maybe better to provide loans to rice farmers (joke joke)
Peter
This is not a bad idea.
It is a good way to get your family discounted rice and help out the farmer in the process...
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: Terpe on September 29, 2010, 05:20:43 PM
Seem to be having some problems making a post. So just added these words at the top.
Anyway:-
Thanks for all the comments. Very helpful.
I think overall would not have any objections to my wife about the idea.
Solely on financials it\'s about break-even or maybe slightly better.
But... as has been said it actually puts food on the table for many
(not just family members)
Personally I think it will be very interesting for me to learn about rice farming, and
will also give us both more reasons to travel to Nueva Ecija (somewhere I really enjoy)
I\'m not thinking of this as a business venture at all.
But just wanted to gauge if it was going to be a money pit (and seems not)

All my assumptions have been based on yields 2000kg of rice per harvest
with 10% - 15% for the \'caretaker\'
Biggest cash outlay probably fertilizers.
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: suzukig1 on September 29, 2010, 06:45:58 PM
I don’t know about rice farming but here is our experience with corn farming (My wife and brother-in-law handle everything.):

1)   We hire about 10 people per hectare to plant and fertilize.  With 10 people per hectare this can be finished in 1 day.  (We have 5 hectares, so 50 people.)
2)   Then we wait about 4 months to harvest the corn
3)   For the 5 hectares we needed about 30 man-days of labor to harvest the corn. 
4)   The corn needs to be dried before it is sold.  This work is more difficult because the workers have to be able to carry around the sacks of corn.  It took 10 people 8
        days to dry all of the corn.  A couple of days were interrupted by rain.
5)   We feed all of the workers; coffee and bread in the morning, lunch and merienda.  (It worked out to about Php 40 per person per day.)

The weather is an important part of “family” farming.  We depend on rain for the source of water.  If it doesn’t rain for a while, the corn yield is lower.

Now when it’s time to harvest you don’t want any rain.  The corn needs to be dried.  If it rains while you’re drying your corn (out on the road) and the corn stays wet for a significant amount of time you can get mold.  This will reduce the value of the corn when sold.

Where we live everyone grows corn so workers for all of these activities are readily available.  We have to pay higher than the norm so that we can hire a large number of people at one time.

We make a profit of Php 35,000 – 40,000 per hectare per year.  (2 plantings per year.)

For 5 hectares.  Planting May 4, 2010.  Harvest August 24, 2010.

69000  seed & fertilizer
7000   tractor
7500   people planting
1500   food
10000   side dressing
95000   
   
5000   people picking corn
5000   food
7000   karyada
16000   drying
11550   kernel removal
44550   
   
231885   revenue; 22231 kg * Php 10.4/kg
139550   costs
92335   profit
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on September 29, 2010, 06:57:48 PM
Some VERY good points from suzukig1

Reminded me of another point -

Is rice field irrigated and is irrigation within your control or dependant on a co-operative?

Our rice field is irrigated by co-operative and 1 harvest suffered from drought hence lower yield
We had no control over the irrigation flow


**use of certain hybrids and local conditions can change 2 harvests a year to 3 or increase yield by 40-50%
Brother in law opposed to this because \"hybrid attracts high wind and destroys crop\"  ???

*** hybrids do demand more expensive specialised fertilisers
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: Terpe on September 29, 2010, 08:01:37 PM
captainron,
Thanks for the very important point about irrigation.
I must admit I had not really thought about who controls it! or how!
Better get some info on that
Thankyou
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: Terpe on September 29, 2010, 08:08:28 PM
suzukig1,
Thank you so much for your post. It\'s really great that you took the time
to share such important detail.
Very interesting
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on September 29, 2010, 09:50:05 PM
Our rice harvest is taking part right now.....

Price to wholesaler is P14/kilo
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: dylanaz on September 30, 2010, 04:44:44 AM

231885   revenue; 22231 kg * Php 10.4/kg
139550   costs
92335   profit


Thanks for sharing these numbers ! This is great to see and instantly get an idea what 5 hectares can put in your pocket yearly...

WIth my 1 hectare (if I ever decide to accept it from the family a few hrs from CDO) I can divide that by 5 and easily guess a yearly profit of 18000 pesos ! nice !


Ya - to a local that is excellent - keep food on the table AND have money left over even with a small plot of land !

All my assumptions have been based on yields 2000kg of rice per harvest
with 10% - 15% for the \'caretaker\'

I think my house eats up to 25 kilo of rice each month (that I supply)... so with 2 harvests yearly I can have free rice for life ! nice

Me, Wife, kid, 1-2 RANDOM relatives of the wife and usually 3-4 of MY own friends...
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: suzukig1 on September 30, 2010, 07:45:30 AM


Brother in law opposed to this because \"hybrid attracts high wind and destroys crop\"  ???



We used to try and plant corn 3 times per year but 1 planting was completely wiped out one year by a typhoon and lost part of a crop in another year due to a typhoon.  Now we avoid September and October and March and April (too dry).
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on September 30, 2010, 05:46:26 PM
Milling rice......

You can expect one 50 kilo sack of milled rice from two sacks out of the field and dried. Granted, that\'s just a rule of thumb!

The size of the rice kennels makes a big difference also!
B-Ray

Don\'t totally agree......from freshly harvested sacks, after drying you will lose 50% of WEIGHT, milling loses 20-25% of volume in our experience
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: cogon88 on September 30, 2010, 06:28:22 PM
THis is what our rice mill will return on 100 kilos of paddy @ 14% moisture of the 100 Kilos you will receive 67 kilos of rice, 20 kilos of husks and 13 Kilos of Rice Bran

14% is considered dried rice most rice harvested in the field is around 23% moisture so when purchasing rice it is important to figure how much weight loss you will occur to bring the rice down to proper milling moisture point

you also need to make sure that the paddy is not full of light paddy many of the planters here do not plant hybrid seeds because of this the rice many of the paddy kernels do not have any grain in them they are just husks this will reduce the recovery return and also the price paid for the paddy

Current price for paddy in our area today is 12.50 kilo at 23% moisture picked up in the field current price for 50 kilo sack of good white is 1250 pisos well milled 1350 at the mill

Tom / Roxas City


Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: dylanaz on October 01, 2010, 04:20:29 AM
Everything I never needed to know about rice was taught to me in elementary school...

after reading:

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_XPSc1RRxPZk/Sq7nNvDWZuI/AAAAAAAABk8/tmuwc6bPaJY/s320/the+good+earth+1.jpg)
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: cogon88 on October 01, 2010, 07:08:22 AM
 dylanaz  did not read the book but saw the movie

 tom /roxas city
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: dylanaz on October 01, 2010, 07:15:35 AM
dylanaz  did not read the book but saw the movie

 tom /roxas city


Contrair mon frier !
(http://media.wiley.com/product_data/coverImage/52/08220053/0822005352.jpg)
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on October 01, 2010, 02:51:59 PM
Probably so Ray, I can only quote what I personally observed also, we grow a Panda quality rice.....for some reason my brother in law has sewn two (at least) seed types this harvest (6 cavans of harvest so far is pearl ...for bico).

I\'m very respectful of Tom\'s experience and would suggest that he\'s waaaay more knowledgable than I in this respect.

Regional differences may play some part too. We live in Bohol, but rice field is just outside Butuan.... so we are not exactly \"hands on\"
With 2/3 of harvest in we\'ve got 55 cavans in so far.....wholesaler paying P14/kilo (yesterday)

Capt. does the TYPE of rice have a factor with your findings?

I just report what \"I\" know since we pay/transport the milling of Willies rice and get a sack and the hops.

The old barter system at work.  ;D 

Maybe the rice mill has something to do with at yelled also? Willie watches the Pinoy miller closely during the operation, checking right behind him!! Pinoy \"that\'s good enougt\" can prevail!!
B-Ray

Milling rice......

You can expect one 50 kilo sack of milled rice from two sacks out of the field and dried. Granted, that\'s just a rule of thumb!

The size of the rice kennels makes a big difference also!
B-Ray

Don\'t totally agree......from freshly harvested sacks, after drying you will lose 50% of WEIGHT, milling loses 20-25% of volume in our experience
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: cogon88 on October 01, 2010, 03:53:59 PM
hanks Captain Ron for the vote of confidence

The rice mill does effect the recovery rate our rice milling lines are the latest technology made in China and are maintained weekly.

Most of the local mills in our area return 50% rice from the paddy and it is usually a lower grade with more brokens. The traveling rice mills return even less then this we usually mill the rice NFA buys from the farmers NFA test mills a minimum of 500 bags and computes the recovery rates as well as grades the rice your mill has to recover at least 56% to be able to bid on the NFA milling our last test milling a few weeks ago was 67% return with 15% brokens

The paddy also effects the return rate if the farmers use last years harvest for seed the return rate is usually lower as many of the seeds are inferior and do not produce kernels this practice also lowers the yield potential by as much as 40% verses hybrid seed I have bought some hybrid long grain rice that returned as high as 73 % but it was very good paddy

The price of paddy also varies from area to area we just bought 3/10 wheeler truck loads of paddy today tested 23% moisture long grain hybrid for 10.50 kilo delivered our mill price is lower due to the constant rain and moisture content

I have been rice milling now for 10 years here and learn something new everyday on an average month we usually mill in excess of 55,000 /50 kilo bags of rice

If you guys get up to Roxas City stop in a take the nickel tour just ask any one where the kano rice mill is on panay island

Best Regards

Tom / Roxas City 
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on October 01, 2010, 04:20:17 PM
Tom, are you using SRI practices?

SRI - System of Rice Intensification

http://ciifad.cornell.edu/sri/extmats/nepsrigpengex.pdf (http://ciifad.cornell.edu/sri/extmats/nepsrigpengex.pdf)

I want my brother in law to devote 1/4 of the field to SRI next harvest
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: cogon88 on October 01, 2010, 05:34:48 PM

Captain Ron

Great article just wonder if you could get anyone here to practice it most of the farmers in our area give a percentage of the harvest for tilling, planting and harvesting local rice traders finance the fertilizer and the seed and have first rights to purchase the crop when it is all said and done there is very little money left for the farmer

I do not plant rice as it is easier to buy paddy at harvest we only purchase a small amount of paddy each year maybe 40,000 sacks 70 percent of our income comes from milling rice for 60 plus local traders who mill rice with us year round we have 30 some trucks a day bringing rice for milling

We also are able to make a profit by purchasing milled rice from the  traders and distributing it to larger traders in Negros and CDO and Cebu we turn a small profit per bag but it enables the millers to turn their capital this increases the volume of milling so far so good

10 years ago I was told by everyone I was crazy to build a new rice mill in our area as there were 24 mills within 25 miles of us and they did not need a new mill here
I now have some traders driving over 70Km to bring rice to us for milling because of the higher returns and our high capacity machines while the other local mills sleep we run all night

Good luck on getting your brother in law to test the SRI practices hope it does well him

Best regards

Tom / Roxas City


Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: cogon88 on October 03, 2010, 05:37:08 PM
B-ray you are paying a lot of money to mill your rice

We charge the highest milling fee at our mill here in the Capiz area @ 70 piso per 50 kilo bag of well milled rice. Most older mills here charge 50 piso per bag of finished rice.  Even up in Luzon in cagayan valley the going rate is only 100 piso per 50 Kilo bag I know this as we talk with many of these  rice mill owners there weekly

175 Piso per bag is way to much for a milling fee, usually the bran recovered from the milling process covers the milling fees at least in our mill. What area of the RP do you live in I need to build a rice mill there as far as the trucking we also hire 10 wheeler trucks to haul rice to Iloilo cost is 20 piso per 50 kilo bag milage one way 125KM

As far as building a traveling rice mill there are many in our are they usually have a one pass mill in a Jitney hooked up to a 4 cyl Izusu engine my friend has an old one behind his cannery here could be a fixer upper. A new mill for it would cost around 1200 USD these travel the roads in our area and mill from 1 -10 bags at a time for individuals some days if I go to Roxas City I may pass 5 of these in the 30 km drive You have to have a License from NFA to mill rice they are also requiring these units now to have a husk box on the truck instead of dumping the husks along the shoulder of the road

I would talk with the adopted family first seems to me you may be paying your share and there share as well of the milling maybe also on the planting

Be Glad to answer any of your questions just drop me a note if you get over to Roxas please stop in for a cup of Coffee have attached my contact numbers for you

Farmers Milling & Supply Inc.
Tin# 006-025-965
Tom Moskal
Cogon, Panitan Capiz Panay Island 
Republic of the Philippines 5815
Phone 63-36-634-0669
E-mail Farmersmilling@gmail.com or cogon88@yahoo.com





Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on October 03, 2010, 08:02:00 PM
Ray,

Tom\'s on the ball on this one as well......when first told how much milling would cost it was P3/kilo

We negotiated FREE MILLING in exchange for mill keeping the bran (good for pig feed/alcohol rementation/beauty products) and husks (fuel for fires/power generation)

They would have kept the bran and husks anyway, but once they knew that WE KNEW it wasn\'t without value it was diffeent ball game



Tom,

Does anyone ever request just de-husking the rice to produce brown rice? My wife doesn\'t like it but have convinced her it\'s healthier for me (as a diabetic) than white rice (well I think I\'ve convinced her).
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: cogon88 on October 04, 2010, 07:02:02 AM
Captain Ron,

We do mill what is called Bahat here locally this is rice that is just run through 1 whitener instead of all 4 it rice comes out brown as it still has quite a lot of bran on it most people buy it for their employees as they claim it fills their bellies quicker

 I have one expat friend that likes the plain rice just husked only problem is this will spoil in a few days and is very chewy when cooked.

The bran in our area belongs to the Trader a bag of 50 Kilos sells from 500- 600 piso depending on the time of year

Best Regards

Tom / Roxas City

Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: rdjlazo@yahoo.com on October 09, 2010, 07:42:33 PM
Folks,
Keep the farming issue going. Thats how we can help  farmers and or relatives
who don\'t have a chance to have their own farm. If we can improve rice harvest with
technology and methods we learn here will be a good improvement.
Improved methods can mean improve harvest and can make the difference
between profit or loss.
Cogon, Captain and all keep up the good work. We need people like you here.
Best regaards,
Rudy
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: Terpe on October 09, 2010, 08:04:42 PM
I am still attempting to secure answers to some questions I have asked about our proposed rice field.
Especially in connection with who owns and controls irrigation.
So far no information.

I am still learning a lot of very good information here. Thanks to all.

By the way I have another question:-

From the info I am getting from family, it seems that most of the rice grown in their  area (Nueva Ecija)
is now hybrid. They say this allows 3 harvests per year with good yield.
Additionally they tell me better against snails (they don\'t tell me why or how they measure, just their gut feeling)

Does anyone have any information on either hybrid rice capabilities?
or snails (especially when growing hybrid rice) ?


Peter
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: aerosick on October 09, 2010, 08:08:41 PM
Here\'s some information to read:

http://www.fao.org/docrep/field/003/AC180E/AC180E05.htm

Billy
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n on October 09, 2010, 11:52:39 PM
Peter,

my research has shown the following

hybrids can increase harvest by 50% thru increased yield or 3rd harvest per year

however some hybrids need very special fertilizer, tying you into one producer, ie a monoplistic pricing system for both your seeds and fertilizer

contact your local Dept of Agriculture for advice for your region
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: rdjlazo@yahoo.com on October 10, 2010, 03:27:55 AM
Folks,

That\'s why we should look into organic fertilizer for our
rice field. It\'s amazing how much district offices of DAR
have. Little more work for the farmers but save bunch
of money vs comml fertilizer. I will post here the first hand info
on organic fertilizer for rice farm as soon as I get hold of them.
Good for the environment too. We Don\'t have to be
 organic certified but the increased production
and lower fertilizer cost will be nice.
In the mean time let\'s all together search that info.
Have a good farming days
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: barili boy on October 10, 2010, 03:55:28 AM
We have been growning corn as a source of food for the pigs and chickens. Realisically due to dry season we get 2 crops per year and I\'ve got to agree with SUZUKIG1\'s figures in that you could expect between P10000 to P12000 per hectare per crop after milling. I\'ve tried to crucnch the numbers on buying land and then groing a crop on it to make money. The profit margins are slim. It is a subsistance venture if you factor in the amount of money you spend on land verses crop profit. If you can rent the land in question then the numbers look better.
Title: Re: Rice Field
Post by: rdjlazo@yahoo.com on October 10, 2010, 07:59:28 AM
Peter,
If irrigation is available in your area you can access it.
Most of the time it was provided by the govt as a service
to people.
You are right that renting rice field  is way more profitable.
Nearby Puerto Pricesa some clear ready to plant rice fields will
rent for 3 cabans per harvest per hectare.  Also if it is becoming
profitable to you you can make an offer to buy it if the price
is to your term. Don\'t pay all cash. offer monthly or quarterly or annual
payment arrangement. We have to hold on to our cash. Cash is king
so conserve and hoard cash  if you can. Keep in mind
if you look around there are many  ready to plant rice fields
you can rent or buy. Some owners are not in the area
or owner just lost interest due to lack of money for seed and fertilizer.
Please publish experience and new things we can use.
Best regards,
Rudy