Author Topic: Nursing  (Read 13573 times)

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #15 on: August 22, 2010, 08:37:53 PM »
They are going to 5 years so as to have them be able to pass the U.S. nursing boards exam to become \"Registered Nurses\" so the hospitals in the U.S. can fill the RN nursing shortages that have existed in the U.S. for years.  Many come from the RP to the U.S. to be nurses... but the U.S. doesn\'t need more LVN or practical nurses... it needs RNs.

So, the Philippines nursing training system is changing their training specifically so the nurses they train can leave the PI to go to America??

As to why not pay more and keep better trained nurses in the RP... that same question applies to every skilled OFW... and I too wish the RP could find a way to solve it.  But for now... more affluent countries will continue to obtain less expensive skilled and unskilled labor from poorer countries... and thus the skill sets that are in demand in the more affluent countries will dictate to some extent what training is provided in poorer countries to those wishing to immigrate to the U.S. and elsewhere.

Solve this problem for the RP... and you will likely be the next \"King of the Philippines.\" ;D
Easy way to solve that problem Tom: don\'t change the training to US entry standards, keep it PI specific.

But I guess, all in all, foreign income is more important than looking after their own.  :-X

I would imagine that the remittance sent home every month by 8million +++ OFW\'s is the only thing that keeps the PI afloat. Every Filipino family I know has at least one member working overseas. It seems to be an easier cure-all for the Philippines financial woes than trying to repair what is wrong with the system.

I wonder if Noynoy will make any promises about \'bringing our OFW\'s home\', like several of his predecessors did.

Offline tom.inbigdtexas

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2010, 03:12:12 AM »

Shortages of nurses......shortages of jobs for nurses more like it


Not in any major city in the U.S. -- every major hospital is seeking \"qualified\" RNs... and medical care is about the only part of the US economy that is growing... with new hospitals rising from the ground like banks were doing 5 years ago.

Tom in Big D
Dallas, Tx, USA
Mactan, Cebu, PH

Offline JMKeynes

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #17 on: August 23, 2010, 04:23:01 AM »
The scam, as some have called it is not from the Philippine side. We have just gone through this mess. sometime around the year 2003 (this I am foggy on, sorry), the US passed a law granting a and huge number of visas to nurses so that it could handle the nursing shortage in many parts of the US. Tnes of thousands of nurses came from abroad to be nurses in the US. Three years ago, this time-dated law expired. the last three years, only 300 nurses per year have entered the US for the first time. (There is another such law pro[posed, but with the horrible economy, hospitals are laying off nurses, not trying to hire new ones, so not much push behind this one.)

In the meantime, nursing schools around the world expanded, doctors in low-income countries converted to nursing to go to the US. Now when this huge pipeline of nurses in hitting the market, there is no place for it to go. (England, the major recipeint last year, 7,000, has recently cut back.) My sister in law has passed the RN here in the Philippines, the and also the international tests NCLEX, CGFNS, and IELTS (don\'t ask). But now, since the US State Department classified nursing as a skill, not a profession, nurses are in the same visa line as electricials, plumbers, and so no - and that line is SEVEN years long.

so this flood of nurses are hitting a more or less fixed demand for nurses in the Philippines. Tto get a job in a hospit here is impossible unless you have connections. We have used our meager ones and she will have a job starting in September as a volunteer (NO money) for a year, before maybe getting a paid job. In other words: she is screwed. Her laternatives are really Canada or cruise ships. But with 100k nursing graduates per year, guess how tough that competition is!

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #18 on: August 23, 2010, 04:41:58 AM »

so this flood of nurses are hitting a more or less fixed demand for nurses in the Philippines. Tto get a job in a hospit here is impossible unless you have connections. We have used our meager ones and she will have a job starting in September as a volunteer (NO money) for a year, before maybe getting a paid job. In other words: she is screwed. Her laternatives are really Canada or cruise ships. But with 100k nursing graduates per year, guess how tough that competition is!

That seems to be normal policy though, After my niece finished her training (some six or seven years ago) she had to work a year in the SAME hospital she\'d done her training, voluntarily, to get experience, before they would employ her and give her a salary. And even then it was an insulting and derogatory 3000 pesos a month starting pay. They trained her, for  heavens sake, yet they don\'t trust her enough to employ her?

Or is it just the usual rip-off power-trip \'because they can\' attitude?

Offline tom.inbigdtexas

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #19 on: August 23, 2010, 05:34:39 AM »
... but with the horrible economy, hospitals are laying off nurses, not trying to hire new ones,...


This is simply not true with respect to the U.S.

There is a long-existing shortage of RNs in the U.S. and it is projected to last for many years to come.

Don\'t take my word for it... this is from the AACN (American Association of Colleges of Nursing), the largest nursing association in the U.S. -


May 2010
Nursing Shortage

The United States is projected to have a nursing shortage that is expected to intensify as baby boomers age and the need for health care grows. Compounding the problem is the fact that nursing colleges and universities across the country are struggling to expand enrollment levels to meet the rising demand for nursing care.

The American Association of Colleges of Nursing (AACN) is concerned about the shortage of Registered Nurses (RNs) and is working with schools, policy makers, kindred organizations, and the media to bring attention to this health care crisis. AACN is working to enact legislation, identify strategies, and form collaborations to address the nursing shortage. To keep stakeholders abreast of current statistics related to the shortage, this fact sheet has been developed along with a companion Web resource.

Current and Projected Shortage Indicators

In December 2009, workforce analysts with the Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) projected that more than 581,500 new RN positions will be created through 2018, which would increase the size of the RN workforce by 22%. Employment of RNs is expected to grow much faster than the average when compared to all other professions.

On December 4, 2009, the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) reported that the healthcare sector of the economy is continuing to grow, despite significant job losses in nearly all major industries. Hospitals, long-term care facilities, and other ambulatory care settings added 21,000 new jobs in November 2009, a month when 85,000 jobs were eliminated across the country. As the largest segment of the healthcare workforce, RNs likely will be recruited to fill many of these new positions. The BLS confirmed that 613,000 jobs have been added in the healthcare sector since the recession began. 



The above is from the AACN website --
http://www.aacn.nche.edu/media/factsheets/nursingshortage.htm

Sorry if your relative cannot find a job in the RP, but if she can pass the U.S. RN board exams and can find a way to the U.S., she can certainly get a job here as a RN.

I am not saying that RP nurses coming to the U.S. is a good thing... just that RN positions are available in the U.S. for any qualified RN
from any country.

Tom in Big D
Dallas, Tx, USA
Mactan, Cebu, PH

Offline tom.inbigdtexas

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #20 on: August 23, 2010, 05:47:15 AM »
...After my niece finished her training (some six or seven years ago) she had to work a year in the SAME hospital she\'d done her training, voluntarily, to get experience, before they would employ her and give her a salary. And even then it was an insulting and derogatory 3000 pesos a month starting pay...


King... Now that your niece is several years down the road --

(or others who may know -)

- What is the pay like in the RP as a nurse with several years experience?

Do you think your niece would go into nursing again now that she has a few years experience? If not... then what alternative?

Tom in Big D
Dallas, Tx, USA
Mactan, Cebu, PH

Offline Lyn

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #21 on: August 23, 2010, 06:47:03 AM »
It\'s a strategy so the Philippine nurses can get jobs easily abroad. More chances of employers from countries other than the US will come to the Philippines to recruit nurses. Let\'s admit, US has the best in terms of these fields and medicines though expensive but still the best. And remember, labor export is the number 1 product of the Philippines.

Got an arab colleague who loves to bash US but when his father got ill, he prefers his father to get treatment only in the US. Or get a US based doctor to fly to Dubai.

Offline c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #22 on: August 23, 2010, 06:53:46 AM »

Shortages of nurses......shortages of jobs for nurses more like it


Not in any major city in the U.S. -- every major hospital is seeking \"qualified\" RNs... and medical care is about the only part of the US economy that is growing... with new hospitals rising from the ground like banks were doing 5 years ago.

Tom in Big D

My response was to Kings suggestion of shortage of nurses in Philippines
Quote
There is a shortage of nurses in the PI,

Offline Lyn

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #23 on: August 23, 2010, 07:03:42 AM »
The Philippines nurses coming from 70s and 80s are the best, because that time you got to enrol in nursing school when you meet the requirements such as height. Female should be at least 5\'2\" and male should be 5\'5\". And during those years, there were tedious tests required by the USA and England other than passing the board exam of the host country. I think the height requirement is practical especially if you work abroad where majority of the patients are giants. How can a 4\'10\" lady assists patient who is 6 plus feet? Maybe they are teaching some techniques now?

I was about to take Bachelor of Science in Nursing, I passed the entrance exams easily. But I discerned before finally enrol as I was made to believe that after college I am most likely to do the job for the rest of my life. I realized that I cant do the job of a nurse. I will faint to see lots of blood and cry along with the patients who are in pain. My stamina cant handle hospital dirts. Kudos to our Nurses.

Offline c_a_p_t_a_i_n_r_o_n

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #24 on: August 23, 2010, 09:12:07 AM »
... but with the horrible economy, hospitals are laying off nurses, not trying to hire new ones,...


This is simply not true with respect to the U.S.

There is a long-existing shortage of RNs in the U.S. and it is projected to last for many years to come.

Don\'t take my word for it... this is from the AACN (American Association of Colleges of Nursing), the largest nursing association in the U.S. -

Tom in Big D


For a real world (ie not just US perspective) see this >> ACTUAL numbers of Filipino nurses taking the NCLEX exam DOWN 30% from last year
http://pinoyoverseas.net/news/usa/filipino-nurses-taking-us-licensure-exam-down-by-30/

Now the US may NEED more nurses BUT they ain\'t hiring them like they used too
Filipino nurses NEED money to sit  these exams, PAY recruiting agencies etc
and that\'s difficult for them when there\'s not enough jobs for them in the Philippines
with salaries of less than P10,000 a month and contracts of 3 and 6 months being the norm

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #25 on: August 23, 2010, 10:19:01 AM »

King... Now that your niece is several years down the road --

(or others who may know -)

- What is the pay like in the RP as a nurse with several years experience?

Do you think your niece would go into nursing again now that she has a few years experience? If not... then what alternative?

Tom in Big D
She was telling me the other day that she only earns a little over 10,000 a month now. She did some expensive special training recently, for the intensive care room, and had to sign a contract that she wouldn\'t leave for a certain number of years, but instead of giving her a pay raise for her extra skills they merely kept her on the same money, so she is effectively trapped for the moment.

As mentioned earlier, she wants to go to Kuwait to \'earn the big bucks\', but needs to buy herself out of her contract first, 50,000 pesos.

Nursing is sort of a tradition in the wifes family, but I don\'t know whether the niece would go into it again, given the chance. She\'s never really mentioned what else she would do. Choices are limited in the Philippines I assume.

She runs a little business selling repackaged sweets on the side, to earn a crust, simply buying in bulk, wrapping in smaller packs, and selling on at various places. Can\'t be a massive profit margin in that, but it helps make ends meet.

Mind you, she lives with us for free at the moment, so that makes life easier. More people in the house for security and company when I\'m away offshore.

Offline tom.inbigdtexas

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #26 on: August 23, 2010, 01:41:10 PM »

Shortages of nurses......shortages of jobs for nurses more like it


Not in any major city in the U.S. -- every major hospital is seeking \"qualified\" RNs... and medical care is about the only part of the US economy that is growing... with new hospitals rising from the ground like banks were doing 5 years ago.

Tom in Big D

My response was to Kings suggestion of shortage of nurses in Philippines
Quote
There is a shortage of nurses in the PI,

My apologies, Cap\'t Ron.

I have \"no comment\" concerning shortage of nurses or nursing jobs in the RP... because I know less than squat about medical circumstances in the RP.

Tom in Big D
Dallas, Tx, USA
Mactan, Cebu, PH

Offline tom.inbigdtexas

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #27 on: August 23, 2010, 02:08:01 PM »
... but with the horrible economy, hospitals are laying off nurses, not trying to hire new ones,...

This is simply not true with respect to the U.S.

There is a long-existing shortage of RNs in the U.S. and it is projected to last for many years to come.

Don\'t take my word for it... this is from the AACN (American Association of Colleges of Nursing), the largest nursing association in the U.S. -

Tom in Big D

...Now the US may NEED more nurses BUT they ain\'t hiring them like they used too...


Sorry guys, not that it really amounts to a hill of beans, but you\'re just incorrect on this issue.  If you are a qualified RN, there are jobs available in virtually every metropolitan area of the U.S.  I don\'t really understand why there is a dispute over something this silly.

Tom in Big D


 
Dallas, Tx, USA
Mactan, Cebu, PH

Offline tom.inbigdtexas

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #28 on: August 23, 2010, 02:38:53 PM »

King... Now that your niece is several years down the road --

(or others who may know -)

- What is the pay like in the RP as a nurse with several years experience?

Do you think your niece would go into nursing again now that she has a few years experience? If not... then what alternative?

Tom in Big D
She was telling me the other day that she only earns a little over 10,000 a month now...
***
Nursing is sort of a tradition in the wifes family, but I don\'t know whether the niece would go into it again, given the chance. She\'s never really mentioned what else she would do. Choices are limited in the Philippines I assume.
***

Thanks King,

I have two nieces just finishing high school who want to go to college - which I am happy to pay for - but want to spend the money for something that will be of some value to them in the future if they remain in the RP.  One wants to go into nursing... so I appreciate your thoughts on the nursing situation there.

I know that P10,000/mo isn\'t a lot......... but..... that is about the monthly living expenses for my bro-in-law\'s family of eight (not counting their house which is paid for).  If one of his children could consistently earn that amount it would be a big help.

Tom in Big D   

Dallas, Tx, USA
Mactan, Cebu, PH

Offline graham

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Re: Nursing
« Reply #29 on: August 23, 2010, 04:45:55 PM »

[/quote]

Anyone starting nursing this year will require 5 years ......

Unclear about those in 2nd, 3rd and 4th years......
[/quote]

Dave,

My understanding is that those students who are already enrolled in the course only do the 4 years. It\'s the poor sods starting 1st year now that will have to do the 5 years and find the cash.

I think I told you of a little scam being done by the Uni. that Janet attends. This year (final) she has to do a couple/3 weeks at a psychiatric hospital for her Psych Nursing part. Do they go down to Davao where there is a Psych hospital?? Nooo.

They have an arrangement with a hospital in Manila, where they do this, a boarding house/dormitory has been rented for the time, and it\'s just a measly Php70K that I have to fork out so she can attend. What a blinking rip-off!!
 
Graham