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Author Topic: GENERATOR OR NOT?  (Read 20151 times)

Offline swandivr

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #75 on: August 16, 2014, 05:01:08 PM »
Yes.It is in Manila: 

http://www.olx.ph/index.php/view+classifieds/id/49588828/Yanmar+Air-cooled+Diesel+Generating+Set+%285.5+kva%29+BRANDNEW?referralKeywords=yanmar+generator&event=Search+Ranking,Position,1-3,3

also,this dealer sells Kubota diesel engines:


http://www.olx.ph/index.php/view+classifieds/id/45288541/Kubota+Diesel+Engines?event=Search+Ranking,Position,1-6,6#advertisementDetails

I too would like the functionality to be able to also power a water pump..or whatever.That would be the one "plus" for a handbuilt..you could alter the construction to allow for all kinds of alternate uses.

I like this thread. :D

Offline Shewmake

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #76 on: August 17, 2014, 08:39:42 AM »
Hey this is great info. I am considering getting one seriously. Now armed with all this information, I am sure I Know what I need. FANTASTIC!  :D
Here for good,
Stephen

If you could kick the person in the pants responsible for most of your trouble, you wouldn't sit for a month. Theodore Roosevelt

Offline Leinster Lad

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #77 on: August 17, 2014, 10:58:07 AM »
Just one other point to consider.
A 2 pole generator needs to spin at 3600 rpm to make 60 Hz frequency.
a 4 pole generator only needs 1800 rpm
an 8 pole needs 900 rpm.

The lower the rpm, the less noise, the less vibration, the less wear, the less fuel consumption.

Diesel engine make their power ( and torque )  at low revs.
Diesel engines do not like high revs and wear out quicker. ( reciprocating mass and all that....... )
4 and 2 stroke petrol engines have to rev higher to produce their power.

2 pole generators ( alternator, dynamo )  are cheap to make and need higher rpm to make the required frequency ( ie 3600 rpm for 60 Hz ) these are suited to petrol engines, 2 stroke engines in particular.

4 and 8 pole generators require lower rpm to create the required frequency, and are therefore more suited to the slower revving diesel engines.



Offline coleman2347

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #78 on: August 17, 2014, 11:02:10 AM »
Just one other point to consider.
A 2 pole generator needs to spin at 3600 rpm to make 60 Hz frequency.
a 4 pole generator only needs 1800 rpm
an 8 pole needs 900 rpm.

The lower the rpm, the less noise, the less vibration, the less wear, the less fuel consumption.

Diesel engine make their power ( and torque )  at low revs.
Diesel engines do not like high revs and wear out quicker. ( reciprocating mass and all that....... )
4 and 2 stroke petrol engines have to rev higher to produce their power.

2 pole generators ( alternator, dynamo )  are cheap to make and need higher rpm to make the required frequency ( ie 3600 rpm for 60 Hz ) these are suited to petrol engines, 2 stroke engines in particular.

4 and 8 pole generators require lower rpm to create the required frequency, and are therefore more suited to the slower revving diesel engines.



Thats exactly why Im a member of this forum....I had no idea...thanks..good day I learned something and thats a good day
The only thing worse than wanting to do it is not doing it

Offline FMSINC

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #79 on: August 17, 2014, 11:49:33 AM »
Coleman,

I bought 2/ 800KW generators from this company in Houston Texas to run our rice mill here.

Their website may give you some idea of prices for used and new genets import duty is 5% of CIF price then 12% vat is added to that total.

Both units arrived with no problems and were just as promised

Most of the used genets for sale here I looked at were wore out and over priced these units have service records and true hours are noted

http://www.depco.com

Best Regards

Tom / Roxas City

Offline swandivr

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #80 on: August 17, 2014, 01:33:58 PM »
Just one other point to consider.
A 2 pole generator needs to spin at 3600 rpm to make 60 Hz frequency.
a 4 pole generator only needs 1800 rpm
an 8 pole needs 900 rpm.

The lower the rpm, the less noise, the less vibration, the less wear, the less fuel consumption.

Diesel engine make their power ( and torque )  at low revs.
Diesel engines do not like high revs and wear out quicker. ( reciprocating mass and all that....... )
4 and 2 stroke petrol engines have to rev higher to produce their power.

2 pole generators ( alternator, dynamo )  are cheap to make and need higher rpm to make the required frequency ( ie 3600 rpm for 60 Hz ) these are suited to petrol engines, 2 stroke engines in particular.

4 and 8 pole generators require lower rpm to create the required frequency, and are therefore more suited to the slower revving diesel engines.

killjoy.

 :'(

This is hard.




« Last Edit: August 17, 2014, 01:37:08 PM by swandivr »

Offline swandivr

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #81 on: August 17, 2014, 01:38:46 PM »

killjoy.

 :'(

This is hard.


^^

I'm kidding of course.. don't take this seriously...It's just that you'd think that a company marketing a class gen set,would at least offer the 4pole option.ratzzzzzzz.

Offline FMSINC

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #82 on: August 17, 2014, 03:11:14 PM »
Swandivr,

Its not about first class or product quality in the Philippines

It's all about cheap price and profit margins almost everything sold here is effected by that mentality so everything is usually substandard just remember once you buy it its your nightmare to live with.

Tom / Roxas City

Offline swandivr

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #83 on: August 17, 2014, 06:09:42 PM »
Swandivr,

Its not about first class or product quality in the Philippines

It's all about cheap price and profit margins almost everything sold here is effected by that mentality so everything is usually substandard just remember once you buy it its your nightmare to live with.

Tom / Roxas City

Absolutely right.The "thanks for buying our product,now go away and don't bother us further" mentality is the standard here.What they don't realize,is that those who might buy again,will buy somewhere else,and the cycle continues.I won't argue that for the average resident here,they can't really afford high quality,but the problem is that high quality is always less expensive.(or almost always).



I just somehow expected that Yanmar would at least offer the higher quality option.Still,the quality of that genset is likely lightyears ahead of what is normally available.

Offline paulgee

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #84 on: August 26, 2014, 05:38:30 PM »
I have read many, though perhaps not all, posts on this thread so apologies if this question has been answered:

We have a house in Luzon, where there are threats of rolling 'brownouts' in 2015. If I wanted to buy a generator for backup is it an easy matter to connect to the house electrical system, ie buy a suitable generator and then hire a competent electrician to do the necessary work?

I ask this from a position of electrical and technical ignorance and have been deeply impressed, and baffled, by the knowledge of members on this subject.
Based in the UK, and part time in our San Fernando, Pampanga house

Offline hitekcountry

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #85 on: August 27, 2014, 02:55:38 AM »
If I wanted to buy a generator for backup is it an easy matter to connect to the house electrical system, ie buy a suitable generator and then hire a competent electrician to do the necessary work?

Paulgee

Consider another aspect that I don’t think has been discussed much so far.  How hands on versus a totally automatic system do you want?

At the low end extreme you would have a generator sitting in your garage or storage shed and when the power goes out you take the generator out, place it outside, start it up (pull start or electric start?) , plug in an extension cord, run the extension cord into the house, and then start with the appliances that have high surge currents first and add other loads and do the necessary calculation so that you don’t over load the capability of the generator. –very hands on.

Next level up you would have the generator (permanently installed)  hard wired where you would flip the main transfer switch when the power went out and then start up (pull start or electric start?)  the generator and switch on or off various breakers in order to manage the load. – still hands on.

Next level up you would have a separate sub panel that has only “emergency circuits” that will be powered by the backup generator, The generator will be sized to handle all the loads on the "emergency panel", and a transfer switch that can be either manual or automatic and the generator would be either manual or electric start.

At the high end would be a totally automatic system that would handle the entire load of the house and have enough reserve capacity to handle any surge currents and would do all the switching from the utility line to the generator and of course the generator would start itself all automatically.

Each level up cost more but is easier to deal with.

So how easy is it?-- Depends upon how much you're willing to spend, as always easier costs more.

Let me clear up that last statement. The system that is automatic  will be more expensive to install. Installation cost is nothing at the low extreme and gets progressively more expensive to install as the system becomes more complex.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2014, 06:09:10 AM by hitekcountry »

Offline JD

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #86 on: August 27, 2014, 04:43:22 AM »
Nicely said, hitek!



JD

Offline Leinster Lad

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #87 on: August 27, 2014, 11:07:51 AM »
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/5kva-4000w-48v-pure-sine-wave-off-grid-solar-power-inverter-MPPT-60A-charger-/131274472276?pt=AU_Solar&hash=item1e90917b54
would be all that is needed.
Fully automatic,
can add more/bigger batteries if you want, ( to have power for longer brown outs )
can add solar panels if you want,  ( to charge your batteries for "free" )
can add a generator if you want,   ( to charge your batteries when it is night time or couldy or rainy )

Wired into the house electric panel, fully automatic.

BUT, you need to know what your power requirements are !!!
Average kWh per day that your house uses.
Maximum kWh draw ( when every thing is on and running )

Only then will you be able to make an informed decision regarding the size of the inverter or generator or solar or flux capacitor that YOUR situation requires.

Get this wrong and you will either run out of power ( power output too small ( can't run the AC) , or battery capacity too small ( only runs for an hour ) ) , or spend more money than required. ( you have installed capacity for 5 days, but the power only ever goes out for 2  )

Offline swandivr

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #88 on: August 27, 2014, 11:59:17 AM »
Can I backtrack a little?I have a question that has puzzled me for some time now.It has to do with dirty power.

Would an AVR and governer adequately moderate the power so that I could use my generator to run my "more sensitive" electronics" (computer..fridge..freezer...tv..a/c) etc?

Or does it have to be an inverter?

Offline coleman2347

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Re: GENERATOR OR NOT?
« Reply #89 on: August 27, 2014, 02:48:42 PM »
Can I backtrack a little?I have a question that has puzzled me for some time now.It has to do with dirty power.

Would an AVR and governer adequately moderate the power so that I could use my generator to run my "more sensitive" electronics" (computer..fridge..freezer...tv..a/c) etc?

Or does it have to be an inverter?
Since I burnt out the compressors in the a/c and the reefer I use a plug in voltage regulator inline with those and my computer.  For me it just takes the worry out...Hope I understood and that helps
The only thing worse than wanting to do it is not doing it